Can I make HOD work for us?

[proud2bmykswife]

I'm Laurie married to Mike almost 25 yrs. We live in MN and have 10 children ages 23yrs down to 2yrs in about 6 weeks. The older three are on their own, so I have 7 (all girls) to school this year; they will be in 11th, 7th, 4th, 2nd, 1st, then 4yrs and 2rs. We have always homeschooled and have either tried or thought about trying most everything out there. After 18yrs I should have this all figured out, but each child is so different and in that amount of time, a lot of things change. Due to difficult pregnancies, recoveries, and chronic health issues, we are trying to catch up in phonics, language arts, and math and trying to simplify as much as possible in time and money. My two older ones can work independently for the most part, I'm trying to transition my 4th grader to more independent work (she has sensory integration and some asperger's). Of course, the younger ones are too young for much independent work.

I came across HOD while searching for writing curriculum. I like the looks of HOD, but would it simplify schooling for me with a large family? How much work is or can be done independently? I think the drawing point for me is having everything planned out and not needing to think that through; although, we tried MFW for that very reason two years ago, but I was doing K, 1st, Year 1, plus my oldest was doing Year 1 of their high school program (which was an all day M-F and then some on weekends program); throw in a 2 yr old and newborn and it was a recipe for disaster!

I also have a question about grammar. My dh doesn't think it needs to be covered year after year, just wait until 6th or 7th grade and cover it in a year or two and focus and composition skills before and after. I go back and forth on this. I see his point and a good writing program should reinforce the grammar, but what about before grammar is covered? Most writing programs take for granted that the child knows the parts of speech. I was considering using Language Lessons from Queen Homeschool Supplies, but after reading on here why Carrie chose what she did for math and language arts, if there's no continuity or retention, that does not simplify things at all.

Currently we're using McRuffy for phonics, language arts, and math (this takes me about 3 hours with 3 children), and my older ones are using Step by Step Grammar, Meaningful Composition, and Life of Fred math. We were using Building Spelling Skills but there was no carry-over of the skills into their daily work, so I dropped that. We have no formal history, science, or literature curriculum, just having them read books from our home library, but I don't have it organized in any way to be sure they are learning what they need to know.

I plan to look at the program placement chart for a while and try to figure out where I would put everyone. Is there anyone else with a large family that is using HOD?

Laurie

[Sue G in PA]

Hi Laurie and welcome! I'm pretty new to HOD myself. This will be our first year using it although I have looked at it for a couple years! We are very excited. I have 7 children, similar to the ages of your children (9th, 7th, 5th, 4th, 2nd, K/1st and a 2yo). Here is what we are doing: My 9th grade dd is using MFW AHL and will be mostly if not totally independent (except for Friday conferences and daily discussions/conversations about her work). Ds12, ds10 and ds9 will be using Preparing (extentions for 7th grader with additional Science). Ds7 and dd5 will use LHFHG. Ds7 is a bit "behind" in reading and writing while dd5 is ahead...which puts them at about the same level, except in math where ds7 is quite a bit ahead of dd5. The ladies on this board were so helpful to me when I was choosing, as was the placement chart. As for ds2...we will be attempting LHTH in a very laid back fashion once the others get into the swing of things. I figure if it works out, great. If not, he is only 2 so there is always next year! Check out the placement chart for your kiddos and post back with your findings b/c I'm sure the ladies here can help you find the perfect fit for your family!

[proud2bmykswife]

Sue and Angie,
Thank so much for your replies. It's taken me almost to get back here to reply due to sick children. I have been doing a lot of reading here and on a couple of other homeschool groups/forums, sharing with my husband, and praying for wisdom.

Just a quick overview of what I shared last week. We have 10 children, but only 7 still at home. Ages 17, 13, 10, almost 8, almost 6, almost 4, and almost 2. Our older children we waited until age 6-7 to start formal schooling as we felt they weren't ready. I thought I had things figured out except for my 10yr old who has sensory integration and asperger's. We've not done a lot of formal grammar, writing, or math in the younger years as we were leaning more toward unschooling, but did a lot of reading. Some days I feel like I've failed in homeschooling, but with chronic illness, difficult pregnancies, and recoveries, we did the best we could without putting them in school. Dh said he would homeschool them in the evenings and weekends before that happened.

After going over the placement chart many times, here's my plan:

13yr dd Preparing

10yr dd Beyond or Bigger; parts of Beyond look easy, but parts of Bigger look difficult with her challenges. She hasn't started cursive, and has had no grammar, writing, or spelling instruction. I did have her read some of the emergent readers and she did fine with the last few, so I know she's past that stage.

Almost 8 and 6yr dd's Little Hearts; 6yr old isn't reading, and 8yr old is just starting to sound out short a words

4 and 2 yr dd's Little Hands

Dh and I have gone over and over the catalog and placement chart and just don't see any way to do less levels. Our 13yr old is very independent and prefers to work on her own, so I think this would work as long as I give her a check-off sheet with notes to see me for certain things.

My 10yr old is the one that's difficult to place. I don't want it to be too easy for her, but not too hard either. I showed her pages in the catalog for each program and she thinks she can do Bigger. Last year she complained about having too much to do - math, phonics review, Rod and Staff reading, Greek and Latin (Greek and Stuff Level 1), 15 minutes of reading each a literature, science, and history book from our library. So I'm just not sure.

My other difficulty is grammar. She might be able to handle R&S grade 2. Not sure where to place my 13yr old in grammar. She does not think analytically at all and struggles with both math and grammar. We tried Jr Analytical Grammar last year and she bogged down in unit 4 so we took 2 weeks for each unit for a while, but she still struggled in unit 8.

I am so wishing we had just gone with a traditional language arts program from the beginning! At least my younger 4 will be getting on track. I do know I want to follow Carrie's recommendations for math and language arts.

So am I crazy to try all this? Oh yes, my 17 yr old just looked at the catalog and wants to do Creation to Christ! She could as she works independently. I would just add more stuff from our library for her to read and more science. She hasn't had a whole lot of language arts other than 11 weeks of Analytical Grammar (which she loved!) and some Meaningful Composition. She used to hate to write and now loves it.

I'll just stop now and see what you all think about this crazy plan.

Laurie in MN

[blessedmomof4]

Hi Laurie, just wanted to say welcome! I don't have such a big family yet, but you seem to have a very good plan coming together for yours. My husband grew up in Duluth

[proud2bmykswife]

Thanks, Lourdes!

We live about 6 hrs from Duluth; we're in west-central MN about 120 miles west of the cities. We're transplants having both grown up in Michigan.

Laurie

[yaya]

Howdy! DH and I have 5 kiddos...18, 15, 12, 6, 4. This will be our first year w/HOD. We are very excited to begin, but I don't have all my goods yet, so we wait. Soon though. Our plan is 18 yo ds will do extended high school so he can continue in debate, speech, etc.,finished Sonlight. He will not be on the HOD journey 15 yo ds-CTC; 12 yo ds Preparing; 6 yo ds LHFHG; 4 yo ds LHTH.

[MomtoJGJE]

Not that it would take away too much time from your day, but you could either not do LHTH or you could have your oldest one do LHTH with the little ones while you are schooling the others.

LHFHG does not take that long in reality... Especially for a 6 and 8 year old because they'll be able to understand the instructions without much explanation compared to a 5 year old!

And from what you said about your 10 year old.... it sounds like she's a great fit for Bigger... Bigger starts cursive instruction, it has spelling lists OR dictation, whichever you think would fit best, and begins to have DITHOR (reading program) scheduled in it ( I believe... if I'm thinking correctly) and Beyond is so light with the grammar that I'm pretty sure you could start out with Bigger and not really miss too much with the grammar lessons. Discuss contractions and noun/verb agreement... capital letters and light punctuation. I'm pretty sure that stuff is covered in Bigger too.

[water2wine]

Hi there and welcome to HOD. Sounds like you have a wonderful family. I have six kids ages 13-6 all girls with one boy in the middle. The thing I have in common with you is the health issues. I have had probably the worst two years of my life with health issues and multiple doctor visits. I also have a child with special needs so I know about all the doctor visits that can add to your day. I have to say that while the last two years have been the hardest on my physically and emotionally as far as school goes these last two years using HOD have been the easiest and most blessed ever. I definitely think HOD can work for your family and I know it will bless you. The biggest think is placement. You want to try to get it to as few of programs as possible but at the same time meet everyone's needs where they fit best. Last year we did two programs. Our first HOD year we did Bigger and LHFHG and that worked great! The next year we did Preparing, CTC and Beyond and that was great as well. This year we will be doing RTR along with Bigger and CTC again and I know it will be a great year as well.

I think HOD is great for larger families. The one size fits all thing seems like it should be great for a larger family but in my experience nothing makes more work for me than trying to make something that does not fit everyone fit everyone all at once. Way too much pressure and energy for me. With HOD I literally just open and go. All of it is taken care of for me. We use different things for LA and math. Some do what is written in HOD some do other things and all that works great for us the way HOD is written. The rest we do as written and I have total peace that it is all covered and we can get it all done.

When you get a look at the placement let us know what you are thinking as far as best fits and where you might see some overlap as well. We'll all help you find where you will be blessed the most in placement as best we can.

[proud2bmykswife]

Thanks so much for your responses! I had already place an order last Friday, but they were all still helpful. I went with my original plan listed above in this thread. I still haven't completely decided between Beyond and Bigger for my 4th grader. I did read today on here about beefing up Beyond for scienc and using the suggestions in Bigger for grammar, math, and spelling, so will have to look into that.

I just have this feeling of finally arriving home with HOD. I don't know if that makes sense with anyone else, but we have tried so many things; HOD seems like the perfect fit for us.

Laurie

[my3sons]

Hi Laurie, and welcome to the HOD Board! All sorts of families large and small use HOD, and as the ladies with larger families have attested here, it can be done well with them too. We only have 3 sons, but I did 3 guides last year and enjoyed that very much. I honestly think that doing multiple guides with dc accurately placed is easier in the long run than combining dc who are too far apart in ability and maturity. I've found the placement chart to be accurate, so I was glad to see you'd used it to place your dc. Because you know your dc best, you will know best where they place, so I think your choices sound on track.

Your 13 yo doing PHFHG can be taught to be quite independent with it. She can learn to use the guide as her own and a checklist of the order of boxes to do should help her with establishing a good routine. The science is read independently, but as she is older she can also read her history, Storytime, and poetry independently. The extensions are meant to be done independently as well. So, your teaching time would be Reading about History follow-up activity (5 minutes), Bible Study box (10 min.), Math Instruction (if doing Singapore, 10-15 minutes), R & S English instruction (if done mainly orally, 10 minutes), and Drawn into the Heart of Reading (3 times a week, about 15 minutes - I'd do Level 4/5 with her for a year and then next year do Level 6/7/8). For R & S English, I'd do a good 2/3 of it orally and assign the rest to be written. Many, many moms do this and it moves grammar along while keeping the learning going. R & S English 3 starts simple diagramming. I think I'd start her there and follow the plans in the PHFHG guide for it. All of this adds up to about an hour of teaching time for you, and about 3 1/2 - 4 hours of work time for your dd.

For your next child who is 10 yo, I agree with your placement of her Bigger Hearts, and this will be where the bulk of your teaching time will be - but, I think this falls at a good time as you are wanting to move this child toward more independence, and Bigger Hearts is all about training dc to do that. Cheerful Cursive is a happy easy way to teach cursive and dd could do that very independently given a bit of instruction at the onset. I'd do R & S English 2 with her to give her a good base to build upon. This is not hard to do, and again I'd do 2/3 of it orally, having her write 1/3 about only. You'd be reading the history to her (which is what's intended in the guide), but you could see about her moving into reading the science as the year goes on - I think if her reading continues to progress she could. I also think she can do DITHOR 2/3 along with her older 13 yo sister doing DITHOR 4/5. For math you can give her the Singapore placement test for free at www.singaporemath.com and start wherever she places. She can do either spelling list 2 or dictation level 2 in the BHFHG Appendix. I'd guess your teaching time to be around 1 1/2 hours with her, and her work time to be around 3 hours.

For your next duo, LHFHG will be a good fit. All of LHFHG takes at most 1 1/2 hours, which will give you some time to work on phonics with them. I'd say your teaching time will be around an hour to 1 1/2 hours, if you need to work on separate phonics and math.

Your littles will do well with LHTH! And yes, I do believe your oldest would love CTC and do well independently with it (unless you want her to do RTR)! Here are some links that may help:

PHFHG and LHFHG time it takes:
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=4244&p=31219#p31219

BHFHG time it takes:
viewtopic.php?f=12&t=702

CTC time it takes:
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=3765

Ways to beef up CTC for high school:
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=5400

I so hope this post is not overwhelming. I just thought I'd help as best I knew how! I do think it's helpful to stagger start when beginning guides. So, you may want to start with the 17yo, get that child going for a week. Then, add in the 13 yo, and get that child going. All with the goal to teach independence by establishing a routine way of doing the boxes and of dc using the guide as their own. Next, you can add 10 yo. Take a good solid week to get in a routine with her. Next, you can add the LHFHG duo, taking a good few weeks to get into that routine, and last, I'd add the littles doing LHTH, and even start those half-speed. It has helped me to have playtimes with our toddler established. So, while one ds plays with toddler for 30-40 minutes, I do some key teaching with other ds at that time, and vice versa. I think that could work very well for you too, having your 17 yo, 13 yo, and 10 yo rotate playing with the 2 and 4 yo's for 40 minutes each doing different playtime things in different parts of the house so you can have it quiet as you work with the others. I think a block of time with each guide would work well too. Maybe a 30 minute check with PHFHG child first, where you do half of your teaching time and then talk about what else needs to be done before you meet with her again. Then maybe a 30 minute time with BHFHG where you teach something and talk about what's to come. Then a block with LHFHG group, a check in with CTC child, and back to PHFHG child for another block. This worked well for me when I homeschooled my sister's 4 sons along with my 3 sons for a bit. However, this is just a thought - you will know what will work best! HTH- but please keep dialoguing here until you're set!

In Christ,
Julie

[water2wine]

I just have this feeling of finally arriving home with HOD. I don't know if that makes sense with anyone else, but we have tried so many things; HOD seems like the perfect fit for us.

Makes perfect sense! We feel the same way. Glad you ace closing in on a plan for your family!