Looking at HOD and ?s

shera · Post by **shera** » Thu Jan 24, 2008 4:55 pm

Ok water2wine and Mary you have dragged me over here and of course I had to mention HOD to annaz. Anyway I have some questions and some fast decisions that I need to make.

Here is the situation right now. We are completing MFW K with my ds who turned 6 in NOV. We have already completed ETC books 1 ,2 and 3. My plan is to continue using ETC. I also have a 3 yr old dd that refuses to be left behind as far as school is concerned. I have looked on the website and it seems according to the placement chart ds would place into bigger I think (the first half of US history for 6 - 8 yr old)

So can someone compare HOD and MFW for me. They look to be very similar so part of me wonders why switch.

If I put ds in bigger, what else would I need to purchase? I'm assuming the emerging reader package or get those from the library.

If ds starts with bigger won't that put him on the young end for the rest of the programs.

How would dd (4 in Aug) fold into HOD so eventually I would only do one program? At this point I am not interested in the program for her age (the 2 - 5? program)

Those are the only questions I can think of for now but I reserve the right to ask a lot more.

Thanks
Sarah

water2wine · Post by **water2wine** » Thu Jan 24, 2008 5:37 pm

Yank!

Just saying hi. I'm not going to answer anything though 'cause I know you have had enough of me!

Except to say one thing...nothing like MFW in my opinion.

MamaMary · Post by **MamaMary** » Thu Jan 24, 2008 5:40 pm

Hi Sarah,

I'm getting so excited seeing so many friends over here! I am certainly not qualified to answer your questions as I have not even placed my order yet. (Feb 1st, but whose counting?)

I will tell you why I chose it. It offers all the things I wanted and that MFW offers:

Biblical worldview
Literature mixed w/ textbooks
Short lessons

But HOD just seems simplier. Water2wine, sold me when she said she uses it with 6 kids and still has a life. I would print off the week sample and take your time pouring through it. That's what sold me.

I am planning on using TWO programs and it seems totally doable and you know I normally have a rule that I do NOT do that. But, it seems like I really can with HOD.

My favorite aspect is that Carrie truly has PURPOSE behind every activity. I don't feel like she gives me lots of choices, but picks the best, tells me what to do and leaves me room if I want to tweak it, but if I don't it's full all by itself.

water2wine · Post by **water2wine** » Thu Jan 24, 2008 9:57 pm

Bumping this up so Carrie can see it or someone else who can help place her in HOD.

Post by **Carrie** » Thu Jan 24, 2008 11:15 pm

Sarah,

Busy day here today, so I'm sorry it's taken me a little while to get back to you! First off, welcome to the boards. We're glad to see you here!

Next, as far as your questions go, here's a link to another thread that is similar to yours on our board right now: http://www.heartofdakota.com/board/viewtopic.php?t=242

Also, here's a recent thread with reasons why moms are choosing HOD:
http://www.heartofdakota.com/board/viewtopic.php?t=230

As to your placement questions, it sounds like you are referring to "Beyond...." as being the correct placement when you mention the program for ages 6-8 and the first half of American history, but you mentioned "Bigger..." in your post, so I'm just double checking where you thought your little honey fit best. Here is the placement chart again for one more look just to clarify:
http://www.heartofdakota.com/placing-your-child.php

My advice would be to put your little son in either "Little Hearts for His Glory" or "Beyond Little Hearts for His Glory", depending on what you see on the placement chart as being the best fit.

Only you would know if your little guy is ready for the Emerging Reader Set, but it's planned to be used after you have completed almost all of your phonics instruction. I was under the impression that MFW K did part of the instruction in "K" and part in grade "1", but I could be wrong. However, if you're still finishing phonics, you'd want to wait on the Emerging Reader's Set. Here's the link to that set, so you can look at it more closely to see if it would suit your son now:
http://www.heartofdakota.com/emerging-reader.php

If you want to fold your little one in with your older kiddo, you'd be better off doing "Little Hearts...". If that is not as much of a concern right now, just go with the best overall placement for your 6 year old.

The ladies on the board and I will be glad to help with more placement questions once you've clarified where your son fits best on the chart and where your little guy is at phonics/emerging reader wise.

Blessings,
Carrie

annaz · Post by **annaz** » Fri Jan 25, 2008 9:14 am

Hi Sara...after really reading these placement questions, I would guess Steven would be Beyond, because Bigger is talking on FURTHER studies on basic parts of speech, doing short writing lessons that coordinate w/grammar, composing sentences and beginning cursive, and independent narration skills, to name a few. From what you mentioned, I would guess Beyond would be a perfect place for him. Of course I am no pro, I'm just going by what you told me about him. He's so advanced, but Bigger seems too far ahead.

Of course if you're adding your dd, I would know nothing about that, but...it's easier to beef something up for Steven than to dumb down something for your dd. Whatcha think????

Melanie · Post by **Melanie** » Fri Jan 25, 2008 9:20 am

Sarah,
When we finished MFWk, we went into Little Hearts. MFWk only covered the short vowels and my little ones needed a LOT more phonics instruction. I really don't know how far the ETC books go, you may be getting more phonics with those.
I guess I would rec. going with Little Hearts. MFWk is very science oriented, and we are really enjoying the history focus this year. I would also rec. not starting the emergent readers until you know phonics is down pat. You might could test this by giving him one of the emergent readers and just seeing if he can read it and then you would have a better idea of where to place him.

shera · Post by **shera** » Fri Jan 25, 2008 9:35 am

I'm still trying to get all of these different names straight in my feeble brain. Beyond is the one that I think he would place into (6 - 8 yr old). Carrie you are correct in that MFW K ends with short vowel words but in ETC he has covered short vowels, consonant blends, words ending in a long vowel, silent e, sh, th, wh, ch ng, ck, tch, ee, ea, ai, ay oa and ow. We have Hooked on Phonics and he is in the 4th level box. There is only one more left. He is not fluent yet in his reading. This is why I was thinking Beyond. My concerns with Beyond are he would be in the younger age range for the program and I am afraid long term it might be harder to combine my son and my daughter. She will be 4 in Aug. I don't know if this matters any but at this point we plan to school yr round with only a few breaks as my children thrive on the routine of school.

We have about 6 more units of MFW K left. Whatever I order next I am thinking we would be done in the fall sometime and ready for the next level.

My daughter knows the majority of her letter sounds and is trying to write. We are working on the beginning sounds of words. She enjoys workbooks so my thought is I can just get some workbooks to use with her, but I am still pondering.

Does this help to clarify. Sorry about the confusion.

Sarah

water2wine · Post by **water2wine** » Fri Jan 25, 2008 10:09 am

I have an almost 4 year old and a 6 next month in LHFG. The six year old is reading Bobs Books. The little one knows her sounds and can do two letter words and some three letter words. We are using The Reading Lesson for one manly (the younger one) and other things for the other one because she is moving fast and I do not want them comparing each other. But it is working great for LHFG. We are taking out time with it and then next we will move to Beyond. My plan is to always keep them together and I can see clearly we can make that work if we start them together with LHFG. To me it is perfect for a 6 year old and I do not want to waste Beyond and the great stuff you get to do when you can read and write. So that is what we chose for us and I have been very happy with it. So happy we moved the other four mid year and threw them into HOD too.

marypoppins · Post by **marypoppins** » Fri Jan 25, 2008 10:50 am

Hi Shera,
I wanted to make sure you knew that I posted a response to your question over at HSR boards when you asked me to compare MFW to HOD.

~marypoppins

marypoppins · Post by **marypoppins** » Fri Jan 25, 2008 11:00 am

Hi again!
After re-reading all of these posts, I would personally steer you towards LHFHG, too. I have the manual here, and it is so impressive. The history study looks just wonderful. I wish I would have known about this when my ds was in kinder. or 1st. We didn't do ANY history stuff in kinder. and then in 1st, we did K12 through an online charter (big mistake, but that's another story

) Now that I see what ds missed with LHFHG, I am a little bummed, but at least I get to start out right w/ my dd next year. Ds is doing MFW Adventures this year, which I think is along the same lines as Beyond, but IMO, Beyond appears to be richer in content. I am going w/ Bigger for him next year in 3rd. If I were in your shoes, I would start w/ LHFHG, adjusting the level of LA and Math, and go on each year from there...but that's just me.

my3sons · Post by **my3sons** » Fri Jan 25, 2008 12:17 pm

Hi Shera! It's nice to meet you! I am currently using Little Hearts... and Bigger... and Drawn into the Heart of Reading. I used Beyond... and Little Hands... last year. After reading your posts, I think that it is important to look down the road because you have said you would like to keep your 4 and 6 year old together. I think that should be at the core of your decision right now, and I agree with the good advice given here by these encouraging ladies. I would put both of your children in Little Hearts for His Glory, you can make separate math, handwriting, and reading choices for them. If you have any questions about that be sure to put them out there. I had written a comparison of My Father's World and HOD before, but I want to make clear that I have not used MFW, I've just looked it over pretty carefully quite often, when I was first deciding what to do. Other moms on this board have used MFW and have a better grasp of it, but I'll just note my observations of it after looking at the MFW guide and speaking with other moms about it:

*the Teacher's Guide: I find HOD's guides totally open and go, and I don't plan ahead to do the school day. Their boxed format makes it easy to spread out through the day or do it all in a row. I can see it all at once, on either a one page or a 2 page spread, depending on the program. MFW's guide seemed to require a lot more reading and planning ahead.

*time allotment: HOD's time allotments are the same each day, and I find it easy to plan our day. MFW's plans seemed long on some days and short on others.

*materials: HOD's materials are all within my own home. MFW required me to run to the library or grocery store.

*choices: HOD offers lots of choices for Phonics, reading, math, fine motor skills, etc. If I didn't like their choices for phonics, reading, math (BUT I do), I could use any other program anyway, and the rest of HOD's curriculum would still work. I believe MFW K?s program is based on their phonics, but their other programs may have more choices available.

*reading: HOD's Drawn into the Heart of Reading lets me pick my own books AND it has great reading discussions, story element instruction, character traits, easy projects and activities, and a workbook with it as well. MFW's book basket idea let me pick the books, but did not give much reading instruction.

*math: HOD has great hands-on math activities written in the guide. They are so much FUN, and are short ways to teach math concepts! I think the activities made Singapore a great fit for us. MFW didn't give much direction in the area of math.

*Christ-centered: HOD is all Christ-centered, and based on Scriptures. It reminds me daily to share my faith with my kids by the plans that are written in the guide. MFW also seemed to have Christian elements to it ? I guess I?m not sure if it weaves it through the curriculum as often or as naturally as HOD.

Those are just a few thoughts I had as I read your post! Hope that helps! As I've said before, I am so glad that My Father's World exists, even though it is not a fit for me, because it has Christian content in it. That should be part of more homeschool curriculums in my opinion - so I'm glad MFW has Christian elements to it as well.

Post by **Carrie** » Fri Jan 25, 2008 12:19 pm

Sarah,

After I posted, I see that my3sons and I were both responding at the same time.

I know it's a lot to take in with our various program names being so similar!

I just wanted to clarify a couple of things, so I could get your family dynamics right in my mind!

I had forgotten in your previous post that you mentioned doing the ETC books along with MFW K, so sorry about that oversight. We have also done those at our house, so I know where you're at with that. We also have done "Hooked on Phonics" with our boys, so I know pretty much where you're at in the 4th kit. That being said, I do think at the end of Box 5 your little guy will be ready for the Emerging Reader Set. My boys went right from one to the other. The beginning of the Emerging Reader Set is even a little beneath Box 5 but that was alright with me to make sure my boys were feeling confident as readers.

The Emerging Reader Set has a choice of Early Reader's Bible or Beginner's Bible, which you use for the first 9 weeks of the Emerging Reader Schedule. You could probably do either depending on how well your little guy is reading. The Early Reader's Bible has more of a controlled vocabulary and shorter stories (building confidence as a reader). The Beginner's Bible is not as controlled of a vocabulary and the stories are longer (challenging and pushing them a little more). So, you can weigh where he is with those.

As to whether the best placement would be "Little Hearts..." or "Beyond...", it really comes down to whether you want to combine your kiddos or not. If you want to combine them, then you'd need to start in "Little Hearts...".

If you do that, you may want to consider getting the "Beyond..." guide as well for the Emerging Reader Schedule, gentle grammar lessons, spelling lists, and 1A/1B math lessons for your 6 year old. I'm not sure where your little guy is at in math, or whether you plan to use Singapore, so that may make a difference too.

In the combining scenario, you would teach "Little Hearts..." as is, adding in the areas you felt your 6 year old was ready for in language arts and math from "Beyond..". It is actually simpler to do than it sounds!

If it is not a priority to keep your kiddos together, you could just start your older guy in "Beyond..".

Let us know what you're thinking! The ladies on this board are so encouraging and glad to help you talk through things, so you can come to a peace about your decision!

Blessings,
Carrie

shera · Post by **shera** » Fri Jan 25, 2008 5:38 pm

Well I have looked at the Little Hearts for His Glory and it looks good. There are definitely things I like in there. As I was looking at the table of contents (which I probably should have before dismissing it), I thought I could get the Bible reader from MFW (which is the main thing I like from the 1st grade program) and my ds could read those stories from it. I like that it isn't mainly Old Testament and Bible but an overview of history. I also like that as we progress my ds would be more in the middle age range of the programs. Carrie it sounds like if I continue with ETC and HOP my ds would be ok as far as phonics is concerned and then he could jump into the emerging readers?

Now for my questions: My dd (currently 3 will be 4 in Aug) would probably fit better in Little Hands, if I did that wouldn't I always have to do 2 programs then. I do not want to push her. My plan was really to not start formal school with her until she is 5. I can see doing some sort of k4 program with her. Currently she is just doing some Kumon maze workbooks and just basic workbooks from Walmart. She recognizes letters and numbers is working on sounds the letters makes. She knows a lot of them. We are working on the first sound in a word. She is not blending yet. I'm sure she would participate in parts of Little Hearts but what would that mean for the future when she is actually a k'er? How will this look in the future?

Along the lines of the future, what is the sequence of topics for the yrs? For instance I know in MFW K is creation and nature, 1st is Bible,2nd is overview of US,3rd is geography and cultures then you do history chronologically.
Are there thoughts about foreign language instruction, music and art? Sorry if this has been asked before, I'm just wondering if there are recommendations for when to start these things or if it would need to be something I do on my own.

Post by **Carrie** » Fri Jan 25, 2008 6:06 pm

Sarah,

You're right that you'll be set for reading with your 6 year old by finishing Hooked on Phonics/Explode the Code combo. and then going right into the Emerging Reader Set. That's exactly what we've done with our boys, and it works great!

Just to clarify, one area I'm still foggy on is ... what has your older little guy already had for math? Is he doing Singapore or something else? It makes a difference in how we look at your questions about long-term planning.

The sequence for our guides is as follows:

Little Hands to Heaven: Chronological overview of Biblical history
Little Hearts..: Chronological overview of world history with a heavy dose of Bible history and American history
Beyond...: Chronological Early American history (done in story-form)
Bigger...: Chronological overview of American history (done biographically)
Preparing: Chronological overview of World history
Then the 4 guides to follow will do the chronological world history cycle in chunks beginning with ancients and ending with modern times.

Music and art are both included in our guides within the context of our history study. The more formal study of classical music and artists is not included in our guides for the early years in order to spend more time focusing on the 3 R's. Here's a recent thread on that topic:
http://www.heartofdakota.com/board/viewtopic.php?t=258

As far as whether to combine or not, it sounds like you could have your little one ride along and take what she can from "Little Hearts..." and/or have her do "Little Hands...". "Little Hands..." is easy to use, takes 30 min. or less each day and is great for preparing kiddos for "Little Hearts...".

"Little Hearts..." takes 90 min. a day. So even with both programs you'd be at 2 hours per day. You'll find this time-conscious approach to be true with all of our programs so that even if you don't combine your kiddos, you won't be schooling all day.

We are doing "Bigger..." and "Little Hearts..." and "DITHR" this year along with my 1 year old running about and my 12 year doing his own thing. So, it is do-able, and I still have time to chat with all of you and write a book! You can have a life, even if you have to use more than one of our programs.

You don't have to know whether you're going to combine your kiddos forever right now. If you begin with "Little Hands..." and "Little Hearts..." you'll have a better chance of combining them in the long run. But, if you really feel "Beyond..." is a better placement for your son, start him there and don't worry about the combining.

The great part of HOD is you don't have to have all of the answers now, we're flexible enough to change with you as your needs do, but structured enough to give you freedom in your day-to-day.

Blessings,
Carrie